Allstate not wanting to pay for 15% waste on a hip roof. Roof W/O waste is 29.28 SQs. Adjuster is saying that it is pre-calculated in there system and he is not going to get fired for adding 15% waste on replacing composition shingles. Also he will not add starter to the estimate, which is typical of them, but now he is trying to only put 11% wasted on a hip roof. Need advice on how to get this paid for. He’s not budging.
If a contractor is doing the job and trying to calculate 15% waste, then there should only be 15% waste on the material, not removal,and not disposal.
Yes, I am aware of that. Allstate is not wanting to pay for 15% waste on replacing laminate-comp shingles on a hip roof.
You’re gonna have to do the math and show him why you are right. And I would make sure to use the shingle with the smallest exposure in my equation.
(Rafter length in inches)/(4in exposure) = Amount of courses to the ridge.
(Amount of courses to the ridge) x (2) = # of unusable cut shingles
of cut shingles / 29 = actual waste in bundles on that slope.
Repeat for all four slopes. If they are lumping in the starter and Ridge.
Take all of the hips lengths and add them together in inches. Divide that number by five and that equals the actual amount of shingles required for the hips and ridges. Divide that number by the amount of shingles in a bundle and that gives you your actual amount of bundles required for that particular roof.
For starters shingles take entire perimeter measurement of the roofline in inches. Divide this by 36 and you will get the Actual amount of three tab shingles required to be used as a starter
Add all of this up and I’m sure you’ll have more than 11% when you do the math and earn your 15%. All state will pay but, only if you earn it… they’re not UNICEF they need quantitative data that is accurate, complete, and documented.
Here are the bundle counts:
Heavier three -tabbed shingles and laminated shingles require four, or sometimes five, bundles to cover a square. When shingles come three bundles to the square, there are 29 standard-sized shingles (12 in. by 36 in.) in each bundle.
Also, link the manufacturers Recommended nailing pattern from the field manual.
Unless they are wanting an agreed upon price up front go ahead and do the job and then supplement for any shortages on material afterwards. If the insurance is off by a square or two I do it that way. If it is a substantial difference in measurements then I would do more front end negotiating.
They are likely using xactimate autocalc and I’d suspect they broke out cap as a separate line item. If they didn’t break out starter as a line item, the setting is probably too bundle it in. However, their seeing most often is to not include it on the rakes.
I’d have to see the scope of loss and roof sketch to see exactly what was done. Unless you understand what they’re doing, you have little chance in arguing with them.
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Yep Allstate told me if it’s under so many faces they can’t use 15%… another “guideline” they have to follow.
Allstate uses the auto waste calculation feature in Xactimate. I can tell you that it is pretty accurate to what you will actually need. Allstate does use starter for eaves included in this waste calculation. This I do not agree with due to the difference in price between field shingles and starter shingles so I’m not a fan of using a line item for the cheaper material to pay for the more expensive material. The auto waste calculation feature is very good. I have had roofs that only came up to 2% waste with this feature and there was enough material on that job. I also have had roofs with Allstate as the carrier that came up to 19% waste. They paid for it. I think everyone should use this method of calculating waste for field shingles. I also think that there should be a separate line item for both starter shingles and ridge/hip cap shingles.
The most accurate method by far, for Deming waste and materials, is the roof waste calculator web app. Https://www.restorationai.com. If you prefer an Excel spread sheet version, it is available at Roof Waste Calculator Excel