Osha

i am a little worried about this OSHA deal. You think they will be keeping an eye on small communities in rural SE SD and NW iowa. I work in 5-10 communities of 500 people to 10,000.

It’s probably not something to gamble with though if they are handing out fines of 10,000.

Unbelievable, i was just finally going into business full time this year. i’ve done 30-40 roofs part time for 8 years and now was on my way to getting a sub crew and everything.

Wonder if I should re-think this as I have not pulled the trigger on quitting my full time job.

Any words of wisdom would help a lot. thanks

Trying to guess where OSHA will pop up is pretty much impossible.From the inner cities to the 1 cow towns in middle america anyone caught will have a nice healthy fine.

My advice is to conform and abide.What other choice do you have ? I have started early so by opening day I will be in position.

If I was to guess where they were going to be abundant, it would be commercial and storm areas infested with roofers.But who knows?

Roofmaster do you really think they will be in storm areas? Aren’t those mostly hispanic and illegal crews? in other words, un touchable by US Law

They’ll probably fine the General and not the crews.

Next question; Use ee’s which will guarantee that when one of them “forgets” to tie up and an OSHA guy drives by and see’s it, fine is virtually guaranteed to go to the GC - or, use legal and quality subs with full ins., etc. that are essentially paid the same as ee’s and agree in a proper sub agreement to pay any fines ordered? More likely that the sub head will make sure they are compliant…maybe, maybe not

You have a point Gus but someone is running them.I am really interested in the comment

LMB (Quote)agree in a proper sub agreement to pay any fines ordered? (Quote)

Will that work?

I could see the OSHA COPS flooding storm areas, especially knowing that there are going to be illegal workers there working unsafely (according to OSHA), Because they will fine the GC, and maybe even give Manuel a fine just for sh1ts and giggles.

Our WCB does this all the time, they stalk the huge construction zones just looking for someone to fine. And it’s not just one person they fine. I have seen them hand out a $5000 to a framer for not being tied up on a 10’ wall, his employer got a $10,000 fine for not having proper safety gear on site, and the main contractor got a $25,000 fine for not having proper safety plans in place.

So, what’s the fine for stuffing the OSHA guy in a trash can?

[quote=“dstew66”]

So, what’s the fine for stuffing the OSHA guy in a trash can?[/quote]

not a dime if you bury the can deep enough.

What’s the problem. Comply with OSHA requirements and make sure your crews have all the safety equipment required. This requirement came out years ago and then OSHA slacked off now it’s a requirement again not a big deal. follow the rules it’s easy.

You’ve obviously never been fined union hippie…

I’m not disputing your “follow the rules, it’s easy” claim but to us contractors most of these “rules” are frickin’ ridiculous.

Sal

You work in different world UH. It’s a much more level playing field in the union, commercial/ industrial and government sectors. Not saying perfectly lervel and suqare, but some basic ground rules are in place. Like safety and profit, for example.

Nothing but the Wild West going on here in the Resi World

Its union, by the hr. of course they got time to frigg around with all the rules…ever seen road crews, one guy workin ten guys leaning on shovels… :mrgreen:

Not sure but that’s what I’ve written into sub agreements. At least they’ll be more motivated to follow the “rules”. If GC’s have to abide, so do the subs.

[quote=“dstew66”]

So, what’s the fine for stuffing the OSHA guy in a trash can?[/quote]

No fine, the “stuffer” receives a reward!

LMB (Quote)agree in a proper sub agreement to pay any fines ordered? (Quote)

Will that work?
around here, whoever contracted the job is responsible.

So as a small independent what do i need to do. scaffold around everything? do both scaffold and tie off? Or just scaffold up and safety equipment on site just in case.

I am making the jump tomorrow to come into the roofing world full time but am not set up with all proper safety equipment. I need some help in getting this in place.

please help anyone. thanks

Call OSHA for a free inspection. They’ll list all defeciencies, but won’t fine you for them. They can be helpful and talkative about how to avoid violations, especially if you’re having friendly meeting with them.
If we tell you something that’s true in our area, but not true in yours, and they come onto the jobsite unannounced, they will fine you for each violation.

[quote=“Jakesnake1599”]i am a little worried about this OSHA deal. You think they will be keeping an eye on small communities in rural SE SD and NW iowa. I work in 5-10 communities of 500 people to 10,000.

It’s probably not something to gamble with though if they are handing out fines of 10,000.

Unbelievable, i was just finally going into business full time this year. i’ve done 30-40 roofs part time for 8 years and now was on my way to getting a sub crew and everything.

Wonder if I should re-think this as I have not pulled the trigger on quitting my full time job.

Any words of wisdom would help a lot. thanks[/quote]

Jakesnake:

I am on the insurance side of things as an adjuster. However, have a whole family full of safety folk. The first thing you should look into is one of your local building and trade associations. Many times, these groups have services that they provide to their members.

Your first priority is getting a written safety program. Many of these associations above have done this leg work and can provide you with the framework for your “Safety” program. If you don’t have a written program your in deep $#@!.

Second, you will need to have what OSHA calls a “Competent Person” on each job when it comes to safety. OSHA always talks to someone at the scene and asks questions. If you have a worker who states “I don’t know” or basically knows nothing about safety, then the fines start coming.

The person you designate as a “competent person” is somebody who has been trained in your safety program, usually a foreman or crew leader. It is a good idea to have these people take the OSHA 10 Hour course and the OSHA 30 Hour course. Many of these courses are offered through local trade associations.

As part of your safety program, there should be regular safety talks. Typically called “tool box” talks. Items such as wearing personal protective equipment, tie off ladders, proper fall protection, etc… etc should be addressed. It is a good idea that the a log be kept where each worker signs for each talk. This documents what you or your company is doing.

If you ever get cited and fined, always appeal. You will be granted an informal conference withOSHA who almost always will reduce their fine siginficantly. However, citations are really a set up. I say this because the first time around they will reduce their fines significantly, however, their real goal is to get a “citation” on record. Then, if you get caught a second time for the same violation, then, the hammer drops as they can call the second incident “egregious” or repetitive.

You are better off paying a higher fine with no citation on record than a lower fine and accepting the citation. Even the “higher” fine is typically signficantly reduced off the listed fine. Many times, up to 90%.

Unfortunately, there is so much involved, it is not possible to address it all. However, if you have a written program, trained competent persons, tool box talks regarding safety and document what you do … you will be much further ahead of the game than the next guy.

Either that or you could shut your doors every time and reopen under a different name … :roll:

Thank you for the great advice. I will follow up with this as it helps a lot.