Shingle Brands

Roofing Business Talk
#1

As of late, I have been irritated with GAF. I just found a supplier who I really like personally and he is telling me that I should try Atlas Pinnacle shingles. He used to be a GAF rep, and is now just a sales guy so I am wondering if any of you have used it?

It felt heavier than the same year GAF shingle and looked appealing. One thing he said was that GAF Shinglemate felt is actually made by Atlas and GAF just repackages it. If that is true, I never knew it.

Anyway, what is everyones opinion on atlas. Worth a try? He told me that last year he had more warranty issues with GAF than both Atlas and IKO combined.

#2

I would say he is BSing you

#3

Never used atlas, not available here. i think gweedo and roof-lover have said good things about them though.

#4

You don’t believe salesmen do you Bam?

#5

lol, well this situation is different. As I said, he was a GAF rep and is now actually the sales manager of a local supply company with great customer service. Now, if he was trying to sell a more expensive product, then I could believe it but he is able to sell Atlas 10 dollars a square cheaper than GAF.

However, we walked around in the warehouse, laid an GAF shingle and Atlas right next to eachother and the Atlas did feel better. I noticed the end of last year the GAF starting to get really light and flimsy. Also the felt that directly compares to the shinglemate felt very similar but is once again cheaper.

I guess the only way to truly know if it works for me is to try it out an a home.

#6

ive done dozens of houses with Atlas shingles.

advantages:

the pinnacle is a 35 year shingle. this is ONLY a “selling feature” in my mind, but when someone is bidding against you with a 30 year shingle, to Mr Customer, the difference between a 30 year and a 35 year shingle, sounds as significant as the difference from a 25 year to a 30 year (but we all know the difference is HUGE)

the storm master LM. its a 50 year impact resistant shingle, approved class 4 shingle for the 21% discount available thru state farm (other ins companies also do this, but the percentage differs) and around here, they sell for $100-105 per square.

the storm master slate has all the same advantages, but gives the look of a designer shingle.

ive been really happy with their product, and am also a huge fan of their evolution ridge vent, and am using the snot out of it, as well as their gorilla guard rolls of 30# felt. its a 4sq roll that is cheaper than buying 2sq rolls of anyone elses felt, and it seems to be every bit as good.

also, laying the shingles as been another good review. they all lay flat, and come well packaged. i havent had a single complaint from any of the crew guys. in fact, they all commented on how much they liked working with the stormmaster LM shingles the first few jobs they did with them.

i know i sound like i work for atlas right now, lol. but seriously, give them a try. you wont be disappointed!

#7

Agape - Thanks for that reply. That is what I was looking for.

Are you certified through there program? I forgot the name of it since I just started looking into this stuff yesterday. I know its free and it sounds like they have a lot seminars and breakfasts and the same stuff GAF has. It also gives a good free 10 year warranty if I am correct.

The gorilla guard felt does feel nice and like I said, the shingles felt good in my hand. I agree the 35 year is only a selling feature.

I am going to give them a try. Do you usually lay the Pinnacle or what because thats what I will most likely be using and pushing the most?

#8

This could have something to do with market share. Only one selling Atlas around here is Menards. I believe GAF is the market leader. I’ve only used Atlas shingles twice. Once a builder supplied them cause they were the cheapest, other time I put their locks on as all the other companies were dropping locks. The locks tore very easy.

#9

SES - I am nearly certain GAF is the market leader. They have a hevy marketing campaign. I know atlas is cheaper but I almost wonder if its because they arent as heavily marketed.

Like I said, the end of last year the GAF started to get very thin. It used to be 4 bundles to a square for a 40 year and now its only 3.

I think I will try atlas but I am still confident in GAF due to my personal experiences with them since the merge with ELK.

#10

I think if you physicaly compare shingles side by side you will rarely find one “better” then the other. The sign of a good manufature is how well they stand behind there product. He’s probably right about the Warranty claim issues but thats because getting anywhere with IKO or Atlas is IMPOSSIBLE! In my 10 yr. in this industry I have NEVER seen a homeowner recieve any money on a warranty claim. In fact I’ve never even had a customer get a response from IKO…SAD! I agree that when you look at them and lay them, they seem to be equivelent but the longer your in the industry you’ll see the manufactures that stand behind there product. NONE of these products last anywhere close to 30 yr. in my climate so warranty claims are very big for me and my customers. Just my 2 cents good luck!

#11

[quote=“BAMBAMM5144”]

Are you certified through there program?

I am going to give them a try. Do you usually lay the Pinnacle or what because thats what I will most likely be using and pushing the most?[/quote]

Bam… i’m not yet, but am considering it.

ive only sold a few pinnacle roofs, but ive sold a lot of storm master LM, and Storm master Slate. all three have been great so far.

when i sell 30 year, im still pushing GAF, and paying cash at home depot because of the 15-20 per sq price difference.

#12

Me im a Certainteed man and well never seen an atlas in a long time. What i dont like about gaf is they make you pay to be a prefered contractor when certain teed does not. Thats my only beef and well been doing certainteed for a long time not orgainics.

#13

Two things with Atlas… the grade of the asphalt and they tend not be as algae resistant and discolor sooner… sealant strip is not as aggressive as the GAF shingle either. I have used them from time to time.

#14

I have done several claims for IKO with the homeowner receiving a dollar amount towards labour and IKO covering a portion of material depending on extent of damage to shingles.

ik

#15

ive used them all and i choose to use IKO 30 yr, 2 reasons #1 THIS SPRING WHEN I CONTACTED ALL OF THE MANUFACTURERS ONLY ONE SENT ME SAMPLE BOARDS AND LIT. TAMKO,GAF,OC YOU ALL BLEW IT,IKO SPENT SOME REAL $$$ SENDING ME ALL SHINGLE BOARDS AVAILABLE!! #2 THEY SEEM TO BE GOOD QUALITY SHINGLES AND THEY ARE $20 SQ LESS,AND MY CUSTOMERS LOVE THE COLOR SELECTION THANKS IKO!! :smiley:

#16

try walking gaf felt on a 7 or 8 pitch. then try atlas 15 lbs. you tell me they are the same. however like everything it depends on your area. up here certainteed is the best shingle. go down to arkansas and try to find a roof with certainteed on. every product is good for something. just depends on what it is. If you have to rely on the homeowner deciding which shingle is better for the money based on a estimate i would say the salesman didnt do a good enough job.

#17

Pinnacle? are you kidding me, they are the cheapest here in Michigan, Pinnacle and IKO it’s a joke. We installed about 1000’s roofs in the last 15years, with Pinnacle and IKO it was builders choice. Builders paid us money and we were installing them. Several years later we started to replacing same roofs. No one ever got any money back from claims. We are GAF MAster Elite and before we became Master Elite, we worked with all brands of shingles. Nothing is better than GAF maybe Certainteed but that’s all. Pinnacle, IKO, BP, all junk. If you don’t care about your reputation go ahead knock yourself out install those shingles.

#18

Being Master Elite has nothing to do with product or install quality. Yes, I believe it is a great program that helps contractors however, it does not mean they have the best shingles. Before ELK merged with GAF I would never even look at GAF.

There are certain situations where people are trying minimize their costs. Times have changed, businesses need to change with them.

Remember, GAF has a HUGE marketing program. That cost gets rolled into something somewhere. All shingles have nearly the same manufacturing process, and with gaf reducing the amount of asphalt recently, it is hard to understand why they are still as expensive as they are.

A material that lasts many years has much more to do with the actual installation of those materials than the actual materials themselves.

#19

When i choose a shingle,
I completely ignore what the manufacture says about themselves. I completely ignore thier warranty.
I ignore how long they say they have been in business.
ALL LIES!

I give them all an equal try, with no bias toward any of them. And i change my mind from year to year.
Why? because they all change factorys,formulas,suppliers,workers in order to maximize profit(or to just stay in business)

I have loved and hated just about all of them.

I love installing roofs. And what i pay attention too is how the product performs.
How does it look?
How does it install?
Does it feel thick in my hand.
Does it lay flat?
Does my nails shoot flush? or do they blast through the product?

Atlas performs in all these areas.
I am unsatisfied with their 3-tabs.(looks)
I am unsatisfied with their black shaddow (looks)
Love the burnt sienna,heatherblend, weatherwood and dove grey.
If i am selling the pinnacle, and they choose black shadow, then i insist on certainteed.

I dislike gafelk for several reasons.
Today they have attractive looks but their shingle is so thin, i just dont have any confidence in it.
THe apropriate nail line is too small and too wimpy in my opinion.
In the past i disliked elk because around 98 i saw entire neighborhoods failing(shingles falling out) where they were only 6-7 years old. All 7/8s, yes, the roofers sucked because of high-nailing but still!
And then trying to repair them were near impossible.
The bond holding the two peices together was too weak
and the bond holding a shingle to the next shingle was too strong, making it almost impossible to replace a shingle without destroying the shingle above it.

I dislike Tamko today(whom i used to love)
because of the way the nails sink into the product.

My two favorites(today) are Certainteed and Atlas.
I would use Owens Corning if i didnt have Certainteed or Atlas. I wish i could try Malarky.

Atlas 15# 226 rules. It has a purple label on it.
No felt is better and that includes 30#
Its better than the gorilla gaurd in my opinion.
The only advantage gorilla gaurd has is, it doesnt print the number 15# on it.

#20

[quote=“roof-lover”]When i choose a shingle,
I completely ignore what the manufacture says about themselves. I completely ignore thier warranty.
I ignore how long they say they have been in business.
ALL LIES!

I give them all an equal try, with no bias toward any of them. And i change my mind from year to year.
Why? because they all change factorys,formulas,suppliers,workers in order to maximize profit(or to just stay in business)

I have loved and hated just about all of them.

I love installing roofs. And what i pay attention too is how the product performs.
How does it look?
How does it install?
Does it feel thick in my hand.
Does it lay flat?
Does my nails shoot flush? or do they blast through the product?

Atlas performs in all these areas.
I am unsatisfied with their 3-tabs.(looks)
I am unsatisfied with their black shaddow (looks)
Love the burnt sienna,heatherblend, weatherwood and dove grey.
If i am selling the pinnacle, and they choose black shadow, then i insist on certainteed.

I dislike gafelk for several reasons.
Today they have attractive looks but their shingle is so thin, i just dont have any confidence in it.
THe apropriate nail line is too small and too wimpy in my opinion.
In the past i disliked elk because around 98 i saw entire neighborhoods failing(shingles falling out) where they were only 6-7 years old. All 7/8s, yes, the roofers sucked because of high-nailing but still!
And then trying to repair them were near impossible.
The bond holding the two peices together was too weak
and the bond holding a shingle to the next shingle was too strong, making it almost impossible to replace a shingle without destroying the shingle above it.

I dislike Tamko today(whom i used to love)
because of the way the nails sink into the product.

My two favorites(today) are Certainteed and Atlas.
I would use Owens Corning if i didnt have Certainteed or Atlas. I wish i could try Malarky.

Atlas 15# 226 rules. It has a purple label on it.
No felt is better and that includes 30#
Its better than the gorilla gaurd in my opinion.
The only advantage gorilla gaurd has is, it doesnt print the number 15# on it.[/quote]

Well said.

Me? I’m a CertainTeed man myself.

They won me from Bird & Son and I was glad when they acquired them.