Xactimate - From estimation to intimidation?

(I should have posted this here on the first try…)

Below is the title of my press release in response to Xactware’s allegation that I “infringed” on their Xactimate trademark. Didn’t know my program was such a threat!

MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR VERISK ANALYTICS’ “GOLIATH” TAKES ON 3RSYSTEMS, LLC’s “DAVID” … WILL MICROSOFT BE NEXT? Minneapolis, Minnesota USA - May 9, 2011

good luck bud.

Larry, with all due respect, I can’t blame them in this case. You are attempting to market a product that competes with Xactimate. The name of your product, particularly considering your trying to compete with Xactimate, certainly draws the name to mind.

Xactimate may be a scumbag company that is colluding with the insurance companies, however, I don’t see their defense of their brand name out of line with this situation.

[quote=“Authentic_Dad”]Larry, with all due respect, I can’t blame them in this case. You are attempting to market a product that competes with Xactimate. The name of your product, particularly considering your trying to compete with Xactimate, certainly draws the name to mind.

Xactimate may be a scumbag company that is colluding with the insurance companies, however, I don’t see their defense of their brand name out of line with this situation.[/quote]

I know you’re not implying that Xactimate which, for the most part, has a monopoly on the ins claims estimating software business - primarily in regards to its mandated use by most insurance adjusters, shouldn’t have some competition. But, by examining the definitions of the words used to make up the name of each product, it becomes apparent that, aside from the fact that both are estimating programs, each has its unconfusing and distinct differences. As defined, Xacti-imate = “exact guess” while Max-timate = “maximum estimate” which is what all of us who do storm damage work strive for.

As I pointed out in the release, with just 8,000 independent construction contractors using my estimating program instead of Xactimate and each adding just $25,000 (at avg 41% profit) to their storm damage claims billings each year, P&C ins would be paying out an additional $200,000,000 per year in legitimate claims payments. And, besides earning additional money, the contractors using my program also save money by not having to pay Xactimate for the “privilege” of leasing their program and downloading their less then RTA insurance company mandated pricing. That’s what Xactware/ISO/Verisk Analytics is really concerned about. That, and the fact that my Profit MAX program teaches contractors how to correctly process storm damage claims so that the benefit accrues to the insureds rather than ins co’s. They’re simply using the specious “confusing name” trademark infringement complaint as a ruse to distract from the real issue which is their questionable cartel like business practices, in my opinion, of course.

There’s always talk about all of us getting together to raise awareness of the problem and confronting it in the hopes that ins will start adjusting and paying properly. That’s hard for alot of guys to do though when they have to be concerned with so many other issues - EPA RRP, OSHA, state licensing agencies, etc.

I don’t concern myself with those same issues though which allows me more freedom in confronting the above without concern that I might lose my license when some bureaucrat zealot decides to attempt to make an example of me. If a good hail storm occurs in my area and damages several thousand post '78 homes, I might pursue that business. Otherwise, I’m free to do what I really enjoy and am very good at - exposing and confronting the “powers that be”, whether they be software companies that conspire to underpay claims, state bureaucrats who attempt to prevent contractors from doing what they do best, the PA lobby or whatever.

I suppose I could change the MAXtimate name to avoid costly litigation, and I may (they’ve got alot more money than I do) but that doesn’t mean I would give up the fight. Even with a name change, my simple and to the point estimating program that enables contractors to price their work according to RTA values rather than those ins co mandated values will still be just as effective and the Profit MAX program will continue to teach those same contractors how to build their businesses into strong, profitable and long lasting enterprises, which, I believe, is the goal of the great majority of contractors out there.

Larry, I am by no means stating you should discontinue your efforts with your program. I simply offered my objective opinion about the validity of their efforts to get you to change the name. My subjective opinion is that you lend credibility to their product by naming your own in any way similar to Xactimate.

I’ve said this before but I think it warrants stating it again. I feel the major weakness with your effort is the lack of a standard price list factored for price/cost differences with different market areas. I feel that until your product offers a standardized price list that can be justified by tying it to some credible base, it will not be seen as credible by the vast majority of contractors doing insurance work, by the insurers and perhaps most importantly, by the legal system. I find I win debates most often when there is credible, factual information from which I can support my side. I know you’ll make your argument of marking up Xactimate pricing by 20%, adding O&P, blah, blah, blah and that’s all fine and good. Unfortunately, it is my opinion that should an uninterested 3rd party were to look at that, they would be hard pressed to consider it credible.

[quote=“Authentic_Dad”]Larry, I am by no means stating you should discontinue your efforts with your program. I simply offered my objective opinion about the validity of their efforts to get you to change the name. My subjective opinion is that you lend credibility to their product by naming your own in any way similar to Xactimate.

I’ve said this before but I think it warrants stating it again. I feel the major weakness with your effort is the lack of a standard price list factored for price/cost differences with different market areas. I feel that until your product offers a standardized price list that can be justified by tying it to some credible base, it will not be seen as credible by the vast majority of contractors doing insurance work, by the insurers and perhaps most importantly, by the legal system. I find I win debates most often when there is credible, factual information from which I can support my side. I know you’ll make your argument of marking up Xactimate pricing by 20%, adding O&P, blah, blah, blah and that’s all fine and good. Unfortunately, it is my opinion that should an uninterested 3rd party were to look at that, they would be hard pressed to consider it credible.[/quote]

So, you would say that insurance company mandated “standardized” pricing is justified and tied to some credible base? I doubt it…and that’s my point. Unfortunately however, far to many contractors who do ins work do believe that insurance company mandated estimating program prices are justified, factual and credible. But, you and I and most of the people visiting this forum know better.

Keep in mind that my 3RS Profit MAX program is in two parts. Part 1 is the insurance claims training and certification program that teaches the process in detail based on my years of construction (40) and insurance industry (20) experience. You haven’t read the book so you really can’t offer up on opinion regarding its value and its effectiveness.

Part 2 is the 3RS estimation program that I created as a independent construction contractor free enterprise alternative to insurance company mandated estimation programs. Why don’t all contractors simply create their own alternative? They, as you have, can, but they usually don’t. It only made sense to add the free (no addl charge) and easy to use estimation program to the Profit MAX program to make it complete.

As you know, pricing is different in each part of the country. Any contractor anywhere in the country - with any experience - processing ins claims, knows that the standardized pricing lists mandated by insurance companies are below RTA market values. They are also neither truly factual or credible - in the true sense of those words.

Xactimate calls their pricing middle of the road (MOR). So, let’s say a huge cartel like rating agency does a survey of “any region” USA. In “any region”, RTA top tier contractor price on a particular job is 20,000 and insurance premiums are calculated and charged based on a future amount of $25,000 (that’s how its done) for that $20,000 RTA price job.

An accurate, factual and credible survey by an honest rating agency would show something like this, for example - a correct current RTA price of $20,000 (top), a middle of the road price of $18,000 and a low end price of $16,000. Keep in mind that the insured is paying premiums based on the future value of $25,000 rather than the actual $20,000.

Will some contractors do the job at that $18,000 MOR price and leave $2,000 of the insureds claim dollars (ultimately the contractors dollars) on the ins co table? If they don’t know any better, sure, and some will even do it for less. Should they though if the insured paid premiums (actually overpaid) to cover $20,000 current RTA market value? Never and why would they?

Then again, lets say, based on a rating agency’s survey’s, the insurance companies recommend that, for better profitability, the people who input pricing into their mandated estimating programs lower their pricing - if they want the insurance companies to keep mandating the use of their estimating programs, by kicking out the top pricing - $18,001 to $20,000 and change the top RTA price to $18,000 thereby making the MOR price $16,000. Even though the accurate, factual and credible RTA market value is still, in reality, $20,000, the MOR price, according to the insurance company, is now $4,000 less then the RTA price of $20,000.

Middle of the road (MOR) pricing is meaningless and nonsensical since a rating agency can simply kick out the RTA top tier pricing ($18,001 to $20,000 in the first example) and call $18,000 RTA thereby making their suggested MOR price ($16,000) substantially lower than the previous MOR price of $18,000 as shown in the example above. Although technically “standardized” price lists, they cannot be justified and they are not credible.

Standardize my price lists? How and why? Every contractor in any region knows what their material, labor and overhead costs are. If they intend to make a profit and stay in business, they need to price their work accordingly. Obviously, some have less overhead than others but, still, if the RTA price on an ins job should be $20,000, that, or close to that is what they should charge. Retail estimates based on the budget of HO’s receiving the estimates and paying out of pocket…estimate away. Ins jobs where the pricing has already been calculated? Top RTA dollar.

My ins pricing is arrived at based on what I would price a retail job if there were no other bidders and the job was being paid for by someone other than the HO (like ins jobs). With a contingency contract, that’s how it works. Also considered are the top tier line item prices previously paid by various ins companies on ins jobs. They may argue but as soon as they’ve paid at the highest rate for any line item, that becomes the legitimate going rate and the precedent. Not an exact science and not standardized, but always highly profitable and effective.

I always tell contractors who order my program to seriously study and internalize the material. Having done that, ins adjusters who encounter the more confident and knowledgable 3RS certified contractor are less inclined to play games and more inclined to fully pay their claims knowing there will be ten other less informed contractors that day who they can take advantage of and under pay. The estimating program is just a matter of filling in all the line items at RTA prices then letting the program automatically fill in the proper O&P which is based on 100% of the claim without deducting for roofing, etc. Will they always pay it? Not always, but anyone who learns and follows the 3RS Profit MAX program and uses the estimating program will be dollars ahead - in fact, many thousands of dollars ahead over time.

Sorry for the less than pithy reply…another rainy late fall like day here in Minnesota with not much to do but type away as I wait for the hail to start fallin…

I feel the insurance industry is totaly justified using a program such as Xactimate, Simsol, MSB, Integra, etc. The adjusters need a program to base estimates off of as do contractors.

If there were no software and no base line price how many insurance companies would heavily push contractors to homeowners that are lowballers?

There are lots and lots of contractors in the US and Canada that work directly off the adjusters estimate. My brother is working for one now and although he’ll do about 100 local roofs after a hail storm last year he’ll leave tens of thousands on the table.

I’ll be totaly honest. Very rarely do I get adjusters to pay my “maxed out” Xactimate estimate anyways. If I did my own software with numbers even higher they would laugh at me.

This whole discussion is about getting more money than what Xactimate allows and not having to pay $125 a month for it right???

“Justified” in using a program but not justified in underpaying their claims. The problem stems from the fact that insurance company premiums are based on top $ repair rates while their claims payouts are based on mid to low $ repair rates. Insured paid premium based on $20,000 repair but ins co only wants to pay $18,000. And that’s after a 2nd or 3rd inspection to cover all the items the adjuster “missed” on the first inspection. Did the adjuster miss on the first try because he/she was incompetent or was he/she just doing what they were told? Surely, the whole lot of them can’t all be incompetent. If not, then, they are just doing what they are told which is to first, overlook damage and then low ball every job and hope the contractor believes the insurance company pricing is justified when it is not.

They already do anyway by convincing them that their pricing is accurate when it is not. If the insurance company calculates premiums based on $20,000 as in the example above, that is the true baseline price, not the false lowball baseline of $18,000. One baseline is accurate ($20k), the other is not ($18k). Again, do the research and educate yourself on how the scam works.

consumerfed.org/pdfs/Antitru … 030707.pdf

And how is leaving tens of thousands on the table a good thing when those tens of thousands of dollars should ultimately end up in the pockets of contractors instead of the pockets of the insurance companies and Warren Buffet?

You’re using their gun to shoot yourself in the foot. They never laugh at my estimates done using my estimating program. They may grumble, but I’ve always gotten paid more than they were willing to pay per their Xactimate or similar program because they realized I knew what I was doing better then they knew what they were/are doing. They paid my claims and then made up the difference by screwing the next ten contractors who believed that Xactimate was the standard and thought they knew how the process works. The reason Xactimate doe’snt like my Profit MAX program is because they know it teaches contractors what the insurance industry doesn’t want them to know.

Partly right, but only partly…

Ultimately, the discussion is about asserting your independence and getting paid what you are worth. Accepting Xactimate’s pricing as the baseline does not accomplish that. If we don’t follow IRS mandates, we are penalized. If we don’t follow EPA RRP mandates, we are penalized. If we don’t follow OSHA mandates, we are penalized. If we don’t follow state licensing mandates, we are penalized. If we don’t follow Ins co mandates (use their estimating programs), we are penalized?

With the IRS, EPA, OSHA and the state, we have no choice but to follow their mandates. Regarding Xactimate and similar programs, although there is no mandate to use those programs, thousands of contractors have convinced themselves that doing so is mandated by the insurance industry when it is not. For those who remain convinced of this, the result is a reverse penalty. With the IRS, EPA, OSHA and the state, if you don’t follow their mandates, you pay a price. With Xactimate and similar programs, if you do follow their, at least perceived mandate, you pay a penalty by allowing yourself to be underpaid.

Why would anyone be willing to settle for earning less than they should be paid

That all sounds good in theory but I question the success in reality. With the majority of the insurance companies, it is a struggle to even get them to scope the line items in Xactimate as intended. For example, even when presented with an email from Xactimate’s own pricing department on how the steep, steep>>, steep>>> and high charges are intended to be broken down (off number for remove, on number x waste for replace), most now simply say “XXXXXXX doesn’t price it that way”. discussing interior repairs, they almost all want to insist masking and floor covering is included in the PNT line item even when you show them the descriptive printout from Xactimate that clearly shows this isn’t the case.

In one sense, this further justifies your argument that the insurance companies are trying to low ball the claim payouts. However, my point is that when you have to fight like hell to get them to even honor their own estimating program of choice, I can’t imagine how difficult it will be arguing about a pricing format that is 20 to 30% higher. At the present rate, we’re going to end up doing more than 500 insurance jobs this year, I can’t hire enough people to wage a battle on each and every one. The other issue is delays in getting the claim settled. While our contingency states we will work for the insurance proceeds plus the deductible, nowhere does it state the Homeowner must wait patiently while we spend a month or two battling with the insurance company over the scope payout.

I’m not debating whether or not your correct Larry, I’m just questioning how we can manage our business at the volume we do should we decide to dig in and battle each and every claim. The majority of our competitors are running around offering to pay the deductibles and upgrades for the Homeowner for almost whatever the insurance is willing to pay out while your stand is we should be digging in arguing for 30% more.

Perhaps if you can somehow explain how we can execute your program without sacrificing our volume and increasing our workload substantially, I’d be really interested.

Those are nice numbers, Dad. Just a thought though. If you were to receive 30% more per claim then wouldn’t you have to do less in volume to achieve the same return?

A guy wouldn’t even have to increase by 30%. I mentioned in another thread about just adding a mere $100 to every claim. 500 claims times $100 is an extra $50,000 per year! $200 would be $100,000, etc. I don’t know of anybody who can’t find an extra $100 per claim with very little effort. Most of the time it can be found in code upgrades for those homeowners who have ordinance or law coverage. It usually amounts to well over $100 too.

dstew, I think you’d be surprised how well we manage to get paid on the insurance claims with the process we presently use. Larry makes lots of statements about different things regarding the insurance companies, their pricing practices, etc… I’ve asked multiple times in multiple ways for absolute document proof showing these statements as fact but have yet to see it. Based on what Larry has said, I believe truth exists, to some degree at least, with most of the things he has posted here. I’d feel much more comfortable with it though if there were factual evidence instead of speculation and innuendo.

I’m also of the opinion that if most roofing contractors who do insurance work would simply learn some simple fundamentals about working with Adjusters, writing estimates, etc., their profits and the overall industry pricing would improve tremendously. I have seen and talked to so many that are frankly, absolutely clueless.

With all due respect to Larry and his efforts, when we’re on track to do over $6 million in business, pay ourselves handsomely and still end up with a very nice net profit, I’m not inclined to scrap that and get greedy by trading what we got for a system that doesn’t sound right to me. More than any other evil, I’ve seen greed ruin more businesses than any other attribute.

Dad, I never doubted you were good at what you do. I’m decent at it too, but I know I always have room to improve. I’d love to visit with you some time and compare notes. You likely have techniques that would improve my skills also.

I’ve found the best way to get your price is to establish good, working relationships with adjusters. I have a few that will just pay off of my estimates without argument. For the homeowners that get the shaft I am all too happy to share my experiences with them about which insurance companies take care of their policyholders and which ones take care of themselves.

dstew, I’ve read enough of your posts to remove any doubt about your competence. I would love to spend time chatting with you and exchanging ideas. I’m sure it would be profitable time well spent for both of us. Perhaps in a month or so, when the craziness subsides a bit and I can take a breath or two, we can hook up for a phone call.

Guys,
I recently purchased LMB’s Program and from what I have read, I have found it very informative. It is not the end all be all program but, with all the information you get for 350, you will definately get your monies worth.

Dad, you and I have had many conversations over the past few months, and I would like to think we have helped each other find a few more dollars. Maybe we need to create a new forum or category in this forum for companies that specialize in insurance claims. So we have a platform to share whats working and whats not. Ultimately this will help us all to find a little more money in the files we are privelaged enough to work. I spend a lot of time studying and trying to make myself better at what I do and I know you do the same.

Xactimate definately has its place when working insurance claims, I can see a place for the 3RS Maxtimate as well. In this industry the more tools we have in the toolbox the better off we are. I often find myself getting really frustrated when insurance companies intentionally twist the protocol established by their own software providor. ( I think i may have a solution for that as well.)

Anyone not willing to change is doomed for failure. I will adapt to any situation I need to in order to accomplish my goals.

Thanks for reading.

Nice post Ray! Sharing ideas with you has been very helpful (and profitable), I hope we can continue to do so. While I haven’t adopted every one of your ideas or approaches verbatim, almost all of them has made it into our tool kit in one form or another. I truly appreciate all your help as well as your open minded approach to the market.

[quote=“Authentic_Dad”]That all sounds good in theory but I question the success in reality. With the majority of the insurance companies, it is a struggle to even get them to scope the line items in Xactimate as intended. For example, even when presented with an email from Xactimate’s own pricing department on how the steep, steep>>, steep>>> and high charges are intended to be broken down (off number for remove, on number x waste for replace), most now simply say “XXXXXXX doesn’t price it that way”. discussing interior repairs, they almost all want to insist masking and floor covering is included in the PNT line item even when you show them the descriptive printout from Xactimate that clearly shows this isn’t the case.

In one sense, this further justifies your argument that the insurance companies are trying to low ball the claim payouts. However, my point is that when you have to fight like hell to get them to even honor their own estimating program of choice, I can’t imagine how difficult it will be arguing about a pricing format that is 20 to 30% higher. At the present rate, we’re going to end up doing more than 500 insurance jobs this year, I can’t hire enough people to wage a battle on each and every one. The other issue is delays in getting the claim settled. While our contingency states we will work for the insurance proceeds plus the deductible, nowhere does it state the Homeowner must wait patiently while we spend a month or two battling with the insurance company over the scope payout.

I’m not debating whether or not your correct Larry, I’m just questioning how we can manage our business at the volume we do should we decide to dig in and battle each and every claim. The majority of our competitors are running around offering to pay the deductibles and upgrades for the Homeowner for almost whatever the insurance is willing to pay out while your stand is we should be digging in arguing for 30% more.

Perhaps if you can somehow explain how we can execute your program without sacrificing our volume and increasing our workload substantially, I’d be really interested.[/quote]

No need to do battle on every claim. In fact, it’s rare that that happens but when it does, I’m usually going to win which simply means getting the job (and me) fully paid. My program is in two parts - Profit MAX/The Playbook teaches contractors from my perspective of 40 yrs construction (40 yrs hail work included) and 20 yrs ins exp. It’s the ins experience applied over the insurance contracting that makes the difference and gives more credibility to contractors claiming to be insurance claim specialists. My intent is to put contractors way ahead of ins adjusters in terms of overall knowledge on how the process works and it seems to work well based on the positive comments I’ve received from 100% of the contractors from across the country who have already purchased the program.

Local contractor recently purchased the program and studied it. Asked me to help him on a relatively small job. Alum siding/3-tab roof/window trim/s&f, etc. Adjuster came out b/4 contractor, turned in Xactimate for about 6,000 less then RTA (combination of Xactimate low pricing and missed items). Sent in my estimate, discussed with him and he increased some of the amounts from Xactimate to my pricing (based on what same ins co paid in the past - highest numbers, based on my RTA est) but said would not do a 2nd insp. Told HO to request 2nd inspection. I met with new adjuster, pointed out missed damage, he agreed, we shook hands and went our separate ways. 30 minutes max. Will he argue against O&P? Haven’t seen new LR yet but I expect he will. HO sold home which closed on 18th and doesn’t care, so, in this case, not worth bothering about. Either way, even without O&P (which I would usually argue for), HO (and ultimately, the contractor) still received substantially more then offered on 1st “accurate” Xactimate estimate.

Only 3 times have adjusters accounted for all damaged items (all IA’s). Even then, attempted to pay at Xactimate rates. All others, adjusters always miss items. Incompetence? Sometimes, but I believe, mostly just doing what they are told - miss items and hope no one notices.

From the “wise as a serpent, gentle as a dove” school of thought, I teach how to control the process from start to finish which includes knowing what to expect from adjusters - low ball ests, missed items, “drive bys”, etc. Wise to the ways of insurance adjusters and their bosses, the insurance companies - miss items and hope no one notices - and move on to the next one. Also teach how to deal with reluctant mortgage loss draft servicer’s and who they really are and how to CYA (Cover Your ASSets). If the contractor and their sales reps are as "wise as a serpent (and wiser then adjusters), they will make it happen on the first inspection which saves much time. This results in increased efficiency, increased profits and decreased work load on same volume.

My est program vs Xactimate…no CAD drawings or any of the other unnecessary utilities on mine, just straight forward and to the point regional RTA pricing (contractor inputs). Adjuster already has their own drawings, photos, etc. so adding a utility for that on my est program would be redundant. Input your line items at RTA and the numbers automatically add up then add MST and correctly calculated O&P then send it in. Will claims want to debate my pricing? Probably, but I have never not gotten an increase. Whether 5%, 10%, 20% or more - every job paid at or closer to my RTA rather than Xactimate and always worth the effort. (see last sentence in previous paragraph)

What upset Xactimate (their trademark infringement claim) is not that people might be confused with the names or that my est program is “identical” as Xactware’s attorney falsely claimed (obviously, it is not). Their concern is that my program (Profit MAX) teaches contractors how to become better at what they do and better than adjusters which dramatically increases settlement payouts to insureds and ultimately contractors (for ex: in 1 year - 20,000 claims increased by $2,500 on average each = $50,000,000 additional insurance company payout. Remember that Xactimate is owned by rating agency ISO, Inc. who is the same org that “suggests” premium pricing (based on future repair/replace costs) and mandates repair pricing through their Xactimate product (below current RTA pricing).

And, they really don’t like what my est program does. Allows the contractor to input RTA pricing for their region and gives a total price that always includes 100% O&P. Easy, fill in the line items, get your total and send it in. Done! And it costs contractors nothing since it is included with Profit MAX at no addl chg. If 10,000 contractors rightly conclude that ins co mandated est programs are an unnecessary expense and decide that my program is sufficient for their needs (mostly exterior work), that’s 10,000 less contractors ordering their product at approx $1,200 per year ($12,000,000) - that will stir up a hornets nest, to be sure (and it did).

Dad, I’ve posted various links to the truth that answer your questions in detail. You can choose to ignore the evidence provided that is usually cross referenced and sourced for accuracy but the fact remains, it’s there for all to see.

Suggestion:

BY YOUR SIGNATURE(S) BELOW, YOU AUTHORIZE (COMPANY) NAME TO ACT AS YOUR AGENT TO NEGOTIATE WITH YOUR INSURANCE COMPANY ON YOUR BEHALF TO PROCURE FULL AND ACCURATE PAYMENT OF YOUR CLAIM AS DETERMINED BY (COMPANY NAME)…

All Xactimate did by claiming infringement was raise awareness of my product. In my opinion, their’s was nothing more then an ill-conceived attempt to stifle what they perceived to be competition. Ultimately however, the press release that I feel is necessary to clarify the issue and the differences will provide me with publicity that I couldn’t have bought for $$$$$'s.

Because having any contractor even remotely construe that my est program is the same or similar to Xactimate would possibly cause a potential contractor customer to not conduct due diligence which would reveal the vast differences and intent, I decided to change the est program to 3RStimax - for maximum RTA estimate.

My final comment to Xactware’s attorney regarding his transparent and less than truthful assertions - “The lemons, while quite sour on their own, are actually quite delicious when mixed in with pure fresh water and the sugar of truth…”

what would be different when using your software, then doing what i do on most claims now?

which is this: I use an older version of xactimate, which is unlocked, and unpaid. (free). I change the line item prices on everything to my own prices, as the market (like material costs) change. I add in dumpster fees, special clean up fees, misc line items, and whatever other line items i feel like charging for, including 10/10 O&P on every deal. I negotiate hard, and use the customer as leverage when I can (having them call agents, and adjusters to say “this is who i want to do my roof, and thats his price”) and it works… sometimes.

then, there are other times, (like a roof i am putting on today) where the cat adjuster for state farm, hit me at full boat xactimate, got every line item, including extra dump fees, and he paid out over $16,000 on a 30sq redeck with 3 layers. only 10sq of it is steep, the rest is a 4:12. So at over $530 a square, im not going to argue with the guy, I’ll just take the $7,000 in profit and run. I’ve had quite a few claims like this lately with State Farm, AAA, and Farmers.

So what would be the advantages of using your software, and paying another monthly subscription?

[quote=“Agape”]what would be different when using your software, then doing what i do on most claims now?

which is this: I use an older version of xactimate, which is unlocked, and unpaid. (free). I change the line item prices on everything to my own prices, as the market (like material costs) change. I add in dumpster fees, special clean up fees, misc line items, and whatever other line items i feel like charging for, including 10/10 O&P on every deal. I negotiate hard, and use the customer as leverage when I can (having them call agents, and adjusters to say “this is who i want to do my roof, and thats his price”) and it works… sometimes.

then, there are other times, (like a roof i am putting on today) where the cat adjuster for state farm, hit me at full boat xactimate, got every line item, including extra dump fees, and he paid out over $16,000 on a 30sq redeck with 3 layers. only 10sq of it is steep, the rest is a 4:12. So at over $530 a square, im not going to argue with the guy, I’ll just take the $7,000 in profit and run. I’ve had quite a few claims like this lately with State Farm, AAA, and Farmers.

So what would be the advantages of using your software, and paying another monthly subscription?[/quote]

Good job on that one and good question. Of the three adjusters who fully paid right up front over the years at my prices, two were with State Farm. What you are using is fine, particularly since it’s free. But that’s not the point.

The advantage of using 3RStimax (no subscriptions or fees, BTW - included with Profit MAX) is that it naturally flows with the Profit MAX program. Based on 40 yrs of construction industry experience (hail claims beginning in year 1) and 20 yrs in depth insurance industry experience working with many multi-millionaire business owner clients (some well known) it gives even the most experienced contractors the advantage over insurance adjusters and insurance companies. Additional info gained through reading the articles at our iccoa.com site further strengthens the contractors position.

Suppose a guy had some basic knowledge of remodeling and had done some work on various home projects, maybe helped install a roof or two but had never really been in the construction business. Would it make sense for him to hold himself out as a contracting specialist? Of course not. Same thing holds true for contractors who lack real and verifiable ins industry experience yet represent themselves as “insurance claim specialists”.

20% of contractors who do ins work have a good grasp on the process, the other 80% - not so much. But, even for the top twenty percent, Profit MAX gives them additional insight, training and understanding from the insurance side perspective that they would otherwise never attain. That means that, once the material is internalized and put into practice, they can authentically claim to be an insurance claim specialist having been trained by a contractor who also has that addl 20 years of ins industry exp.

Also means that adjusters, knowing you are a 3RS certified contractor know more than they do, are more likely going to respect you and pay you quicker and closer to your RTA prices and underpay the next ten guys who didn’t order Profit MAX and only claim expertise. Makes life much easier - and more profitable.

Scenario: Gold falls from the sky in the form of golf ball sized hail. Contractors go out and mine the gold. Some use spoons (free estimates), more experienced use shovels, 3RS Profit MAX certified insurance claim specialists go out and mine the gold with Bobcats with front end loaders. I never promise that all one has to do is read, study and internalize P Max and in one week, everything changes. Internalization takes several months at the very least, but a lot less time than attempting to learn the process over a period of years, if ever, and missing out on all of the profit potential that P MAX seeks to bring about right away.

no subscription, more money.

ok, you have my attention now. What is the initial cost, and are there any reoccurring costs?

Jason;

“which is this: I use an older version of xactimate, which is unlocked, and unpaid. (free).”

I searched this online, but I couldn’t find anything.

Are you willing to give the source of that version? I would love to have that. As insurance prices dropped in my market vs a year ago, I am in the process of creating such a spreadsheet myself. That would really help me out. Thanks.